Fans' forum

[Robin]

We don’t want to be associated with West Midlands grot. City are the biggest club in our region (arguably Bournemouth).

Geographical pedantry aside, I find the notion of a “big club” similarly fascinating. Crowd size? Trophies? History?

Are Blackpool a small club now? Or do they remain a big club because of their history? What about Huddersfield? They’ve won more titles than Chelsea, but had no success at all for 60 years.

Bournemouth have been a Cheltenham-sized club for most of their existence. Are they now ‘big’ simply by being in the Premier League? Will they become “small” when they inevitably head back down the leagues like Wigan?

Very interesting. I personally wouldn’t class Bournemouth as a bigger club than City - only about 15 league places or so apart, and Ashton Gate two or three times the size of Bournemouth’s ground.

Blackpool, Huddersfield - I couldn’t possibly say. Bizarrely, two teachers at my school were big Huddersfield fans who watched CTFC occasionally as their second team / local team. Whereas I only knew one other CTFC fan at school, so for me personally Huddersfield have always seemed to have a bigger and more proper fan base than us.

I will stick my neck out and say that success is not a determination of big club. I think it is the sense of size you get from the fan base and ground. Even in L1 and L2 clubs like Leeds, Huddersfield and Portsmouth has that feeling where passion for the club is passed down from generation to generation and they’d take thousands to an away game even if it was the Checkatrade first round. Whereas as other clubs like us have more of that hobbyist and amateur sense about it, where supporting CTFC and not a top flight club is still rare amongst all ages.

I feel that's a fair assessment, for me a big club is about fan base, infrastructure and history. You get a sense of a big club when they take more fans than others to games (as we did in the conference, similar Wrexham/Grimsby), we were a big club at that level. Vocal support also seems to come into it at this level, passion from the terraces for what ever reason the bigger clubs are much more partisan in their support vs the more gentle small clubs where making friends seems more important.

[Jerry St Clair]

Think you’ve nailed it, Robin and RCS. A big club has “a feeling” about it that is subjective and may be different for different people.

BTW how about this for a definition of a lsmall” club: one whose supporters wear half and half scarves for games against “big” clubs. Big club fans would never stoop so low.

[Jerry St Clair]

Well said Oldun and Andgarod. It seems to be a common feature all over the country that younger fans, hence the majority of it being on social media, calling for the head of their respective manager if their team lose 2 games in a row. Hopefully these whippersnappers will learn as they mature that such action is usually NOT the answer, Birmingham and Leeds in recent times are very good examples of this failed strategy.

Not sure I like this massive generalisation about younger fans being reactionary idiots with older fans being wise, sensible old sages.

Neither is a homogenous group and both probably harbour the full range of views on GJ

[RegencyCheltenhamSpa]

Agree re: half and half scarves. During the Fulham Europa League run half and half scarves were sold out every game. In Rome the away support numbers were boosted by families visiting sites and the Surrey-set visiting the shops. A small club enjoying a day out. The act the Fulham players and managers praise the away support if more than 500 travel shows the small club mindset compared to other Prem or big Championship sides.

Rovers always feel bigger than us when we play them. Pubs packed out, 1,500 Gas in Whaddon are standing and singing in unison, making noise CTFC can only dream of.

Re: fans ages. You only need to see on here and listen to 606 to see plenty of fans from 30 to 90 moaning and jerking their knees.

[Robin]

Rovers are a bigger club than us for sure but I never view them as a big club, possibly because I view them as a rival to CTFC, just like Swindle.

[vickeryc]

Rovers are a bigger club than us for sure but I never view them as a big club, possibly because I view them as a rival to CTFC, just like Swindle.

No one has said Rovers are a big club. They are way bigger than Cheltenham though and if they were to get back into the second tier, they would get very respectable crowds. The Rovers' historic rivalry with City is a big factor in the passion exhibited by both sets of Bristol fans.

It's fair to say that City are amongst the biggest under achievers in the FL and they are a big club in waiting. Despite decades of under achievement, they still have a crowd average over 20,000. To suggest that clubs like Bournemouth or Swansea are 'bigger' - simply because they are currently in the Premiership - is preposterous in my view.

[Malabus]

In the forum did the question about Cake Bridge Place and Council a rise?

[Robin]

Rovers are a bigger club than us for sure but I never view them as a big club, possibly because I view them as a rival to CTFC, just like Swindle.

No one has said Rovers are a big club. They are way bigger than Cheltenham though and if they were to get back into the second tier, they would get very respectable crowds. The Rovers' historic rivalry with City is a big factor in the passion exhibited by both sets of Bristol fans.

It's fair to say that City are amongst the biggest under achievers in the FL and they are a big club in waiting. Despite decades of under achievement, they still have a crowd average over 20,000. To suggest that clubs like Bournemouth or Swansea are 'bigger' - simply because they are currently in the Premiership - is preposterous in my view.

Bristol City for me a club with potential but one of the smaller clubs in the Championship in my opinion. I know they are having a superb season but 20,000 is not huge in that league compared with the likes of Sheff Wed, Leeds, Sunderland, Middlesbrough, Villa, Wolves etc.

[Shade]

In the forum did the question about Cake Bridge Place and Council a rise?

Yes. PB basically said that council are still looking into it but the fact they haven't started building again in Cakebridge is a good sign that they're looking at it seriously.

[Malabus]

In the forum did the question about Cake Bridge Place and Council a rise?

Yes. PB basically said that council are still looking into it but the fact they haven't started building again in Cakebridge is a good sign that they're looking at it seriously.

Cheers

[horlickfanclub]

Not a good sign for people that need houses. That site has been in limbo for years.

[RegencyCheltenhamSpa]

Not a good sign for people that need houses. That site has been in limbo for years.

Sooner they build the new stand and new houses on the extended car park site the better (Council's preferred option for higher number of houses).

Past issue was the nice house(s) on the corner of P. Rd and C. Pl have put in objections against their large gardens being overlooked and traffic coming in and out. Not sure if they were set to lose trees or not.

Another reason why a tidy 4,000 seater and not a huge monstrosity would be better.

[Jerry St Clair]

Past issue was the nice house(s) on the corner of P. Rd and C. Pl have put in objections against their large gardens being overlooked and traffic coming in and out. Not sure if they were set to lose trees or not.

Fulham have just received planning permission for a new stand that incorporates housing inside the stand itself. It seems to be a short term let arrangement. Given the lack of affordable housing in Cheltenham some innovative thinking along a similar lines could be a real enabler in getting council backing. And it would provide steady, reliable income for the club.

[Jerry St Clair]

Rovers always feel bigger than us when we play them. Pubs packed out, 1,500 Gas in Whaddon are standing and singing in unison, making noise CTFC can only dream of.

As an aside, if there's a better terrace song than Goodnight Irene, I've yet to hear it.

[RegencyCheltenhamSpa]

Past issue was the nice house(s) on the corner of P. Rd and C. Pl have put in objections against their large gardens being overlooked and traffic coming in and out. Not sure if they were set to lose trees or not.

Fulham have just received planning permission for a new stand that incorporates housing inside the stand itself. It seems to be a short term let arrangement. Given the lack of affordable housing in Cheltenham some innovative thinking along a similar lines could be a real enabler in getting council backing. And it would provide steady, reliable income for the club.

Yes interesting in Fulham. The stand is essentially the same one Al Fayed got permission for before selling to Khan and relegation. Club have obviously realised that putting apartments in will pay for the development. Houses on Stevenage Road usually go for several mil, so a flat overlooking Putney Rowing Club next to Bishop’s Park, on the newly re-opened Thames Path (currently Thames path cuts in land as the stadium is the river bank) will be a tidy sum. But Fulham must have the most valuable piece of real estate (£/sq m) in UK sport so exceptional circs.

I recall Rovers had plans for student accommodation when they were potentially going to share with us before the credit and banking crisis put paid. Private sector student accommodation building is the biggest speculative investment at the moment and certainly demand in Cheltenham. Plus getting hundreds of students in one block frees up all the poorly kept slum landlord digs back on to the market and hopefully bring them back into long-term quality rental supply stock.

[plymrob]

Thankfully RCS has the housing problem sorted. At last, some positivity on the Nest.

[RegencyCheltenhamSpa]

Thankfully RCS has the housing problem sorted. At last, some positivity on the Nest.

Will be writing my chapter on innovative smart solutions for affordable local authority house building and management for a client in the coming fortnight if you’re interested. Or I can dig out my analysis and reports last year on the potential economic impact of Permitted Development Rights in Central London which formed a successful evidence base for an Article 4 Directive application if that’s more your scene!