Brexit deal signed: the RNF vote

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Round 1 (of 3): how should parliament vote

Support the deal
1
9%
No deal
1
9%
People’s Vote
6
55%
New option: Norway/EEA model
3
27%
 
Total votes: 11
RegencyCheltenhamSpa
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Vote for your preferred option in Round 1.

Top 3 options will go through to Round 2.

And then the final round of two options.

This will be final say from the RNF and afternoon that we can stop arguing about it and get on with it.
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Malabus
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NO DEAL.....tell the unelected bureaucrats to go and feck themselves.
RegencyCheltenhamSpa
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No votes for no deal in the poll though.
RegencyCheltenhamSpa
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No need for a Round 2 vote: People’s Vote is the official RNF preference.
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Malabus
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Based on 8 votes...I didn't vote.
RegencyCheltenhamSpa
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Malabus wrote:Based on 8 votes...I didn't vote.
No vote no voice. Pipe down.

8 our of how many regular posters? The vote to leave was made by 26% of U.K. population remember.
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Malabus
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RegencyCheltenhamSpa wrote:
Malabus wrote:Based on 8 votes...I didn't vote.
No vote no voice. Pipe down.

8 our of how many regular posters? The vote to leave was made by 26% of U.K. population remember.
Google is your best-est friend.
RegencyCheltenhamSpa
Posts: 29757
Joined: 21 Nov 2009, 03:27
Malabus wrote:
RegencyCheltenhamSpa wrote:
Malabus wrote:Based on 8 votes...I didn't vote.
No vote no voice. Pipe down.

8 our of how many regular posters? The vote to leave was made by 26% of U.K. population remember.
Google is your best-est friend.
And your point is?
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Malabus
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I demand another vote, because I don't like the result of this one.
RegencyCheltenhamSpa
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Malabus wrote:I demand another vote, because I don't like the result of this one.
In which I disagree with you; I think a vote is the best way of getting out of constitutional gridlock and delivering Brexit by the end of March 2019.
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Malabus
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RegencyCheltenhamSpa wrote:
Malabus wrote:I demand another vote, because I don't like the result of this one.
In which I disagree with you; I think a vote is the best way of getting out of constitutional gridlock and delivering Brexit by the end of March 2019.
Think you are missing the point.
RegencyCheltenhamSpa
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Malabus wrote:
RegencyCheltenhamSpa wrote:
Malabus wrote:I demand another vote, because I don't like the result of this one.
In which I disagree with you; I think a vote is the best way of getting out of constitutional gridlock and delivering Brexit by the end of March 2019.
Think you are missing the point.
Quite deliberately so.
asl
Posts: 6668
Joined: 20 Nov 2009, 09:37
Genuine question, ihearye: irrespective of how you view what May has managed to deliver in terms of options, did you believe that you knew what Brexit would actually look like at the time you voted? If you did, then you're a far wiser person than any of those experts thst the country had had enough of.

That's not a dig - I'm explaining my issue with the whole thing: given that neither campaign were able to provide much detail about why their plan was best and so resorted to dramatising the negatives of the alternative, I opted to remain because the leave campaign failed to convince me that it would be better to leave. Better the Devil you know, and all that... Other people presumably saw the same 'evidence' as me, yet came to a different conclusion and, by a very narrow margin, opted to spin the roulette wheel and see whether things are better outside the EU. I couldn't justify that risk and deeply object to others doing it for me, on my behalf. If it only affected them, then fine - you go for it. But it didn't: it affected me, too. Nevertheless, I am against the idea of a second referendum for the reason you've stated. If the May deal is the ONLY deal, then the option is that or WTO rules (which most industry leaders, who understand the ramifications better than I, think would be a disaster) then we have to go for it.

Fingers crossed, Brexit will be a success. I don't believe it will be - but we need to push forward and try. Quantifying how much of a success it has been will be as impossible as forecasting it beforehand.

Impact that has directly affected me, *already*:

1. Sterling falling off the edge of a cliff the moment the decision to leave was announced. On the plus side, I do have some US stock holdings that are, as a consequence, worth a lot more as a result. On the negative, things undoubtably cost more - anything made from imported materials will have gone up. Holiday spending money, obviously, does not go as far as it used to.

2. The crash of the FTSE. My net worth has taken a hammering as all my ISAs feel the brunt of the uncertainty. Even my pension funds have taken the hit with the income totally wiped out by the unit value decrease. The only positive is that this is paper money and I do not intend crystalising these losses unless the stocks are at risk. Two years of growth totally wiped out, thanks.
RegencyCheltenhamSpa
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asl wrote:Genuine question, ihearye: irrespective of how you view what May has managed to deliver in terms of options, did you believe that you knew what Brexit would actually look like at the time you voted? If you did, then you're a far wiser person than any of those experts thst the country had had enough of.

That's not a dig - I'm explaining my issue with the whole thing: given that neither campaign were able to provide much detail about why their plan was best and so resorted to dramatising the negatives of the alternative, I opted to remain because the leave campaign failed to convince me that it would be better to leave. Better the Devil you know, and all that... Other people presumably saw the same 'evidence' as me, yet came to a different conclusion and, by a very narrow margin, opted to spin the roulette wheel and see whether things are better outside the EU. I couldn't justify that risk and deeply object to others doing it for me, on my behalf. If it only affected them, then fine - you go for it. But it didn't: it affected me, too. Nevertheless, I am against the idea of a second referendum for the reason you've stated. If the May deal is the ONLY deal, then the option is that or WTO rules (which most industry leaders, who understand the ramifications better than I, think would be a disaster) then we have to go for it.

Fingers crossed, Brexit will be a success. I don't believe it will be - but we need to push forward and try. Quantifying how much of a success it has been will be as impossible as forecasting it beforehand.

Impact that has directly affected me, *already*:

1. Sterling falling off the edge of a cliff the moment the decision to leave was announced. On the plus side, I do have some US stock holdings that are, as a consequence, worth a lot more as a result. On the negative, things undoubtably cost more - anything made from imported materials will have gone up. Holiday spending money, obviously, does not go as far as it used to.

2. The crash of the FTSE. My net worth has taken a hammering as all my ISAs feel the brunt of the uncertainty. Even my pension funds have taken the hit with the income totally wiped out by the unit value decrease. The only positive is that this is paper money and I do not intend crystalising these losses unless the stocks are at risk. Two years of growth totally wiped out, thanks.
Re: people seeing “the same evidence”. Not entirely true, as the Cambridge Analytica/Bannon campaign of targeted adverts on Facebook reached millions of people in their target groups without you or I knowing. So whilst we were reading papers, claims from politicians, or watching debates, many were purely seeing stories about Turkey joining the EU meaning Syria will be on our doorstep, for example.
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Malabus
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Location: The Death Star.
asl wrote:Genuine question, ihearye: irrespective of how you view what May has managed to deliver in terms of options, did you believe that you knew what Brexit would actually look like at the time you voted? If you did, then you're a far wiser person than any of those experts thst the country had had enough of.

That's not a dig - I'm explaining my issue with the whole thing: given that neither campaign were able to provide much detail about why their plan was best and so resorted to dramatising the negatives of the alternative, I opted to remain because the leave campaign failed to convince me that it would be better to leave. Better the Devil you know, and all that... Other people presumably saw the same 'evidence' as me, yet came to a different conclusion and, by a very narrow margin, opted to spin the roulette wheel and see whether things are better outside the EU. I couldn't justify that risk and deeply object to others doing it for me, on my behalf. If it only affected them, then fine - you go for it. But it didn't: it affected me, too. Nevertheless, I am against the idea of a second referendum for the reason you've stated. If the May deal is the ONLY deal, then the option is that or WTO rules (which most industry leaders, who understand the ramifications better than I, think would be a disaster) then we have to go for it.

Fingers crossed, Brexit will be a success. I don't believe it will be - but we need to push forward and try. Quantifying how much of a success it has been will be as impossible as forecasting it beforehand.

Impact that has directly affected me, *already*:

1. Sterling falling off the edge of a cliff the moment the decision to leave was announced. On the plus side, I do have some US stock holdings that are, as a consequence, worth a lot more as a result. On the negative, things undoubtably cost more - anything made from imported materials will have gone up. Holiday spending money, obviously, does not go as far as it used to.

2. The crash of the FTSE. My net worth has taken a hammering as all my ISAs feel the brunt of the uncertainty. Even my pension funds have taken the hit with the income totally wiped out by the unit value decrease. The only positive is that this is paper money and I do not intend crystalising these losses unless the stocks are at risk. Two years of growth totally wiped out, thanks.
So your concern is money worship instead of freedom.
asl
Posts: 6668
Joined: 20 Nov 2009, 09:37
Merely stating the tangible impacts so far.
RegencyCheltenhamSpa
Posts: 29757
Joined: 21 Nov 2009, 03:27
Malabus wrote:
asl wrote:Genuine question, ihearye: irrespective of how you view what May has managed to deliver in terms of options, did you believe that you knew what Brexit would actually look like at the time you voted? If you did, then you're a far wiser person than any of those experts thst the country had had enough of.

That's not a dig - I'm explaining my issue with the whole thing: given that neither campaign were able to provide much detail about why their plan was best and so resorted to dramatising the negatives of the alternative, I opted to remain because the leave campaign failed to convince me that it would be better to leave. Better the Devil you know, and all that... Other people presumably saw the same 'evidence' as me, yet came to a different conclusion and, by a very narrow margin, opted to spin the roulette wheel and see whether things are better outside the EU. I couldn't justify that risk and deeply object to others doing it for me, on my behalf. If it only affected them, then fine - you go for it. But it didn't: it affected me, too. Nevertheless, I am against the idea of a second referendum for the reason you've stated. If the May deal is the ONLY deal, then the option is that or WTO rules (which most industry leaders, who understand the ramifications better than I, think would be a disaster) then we have to go for it.

Fingers crossed, Brexit will be a success. I don't believe it will be - but we need to push forward and try. Quantifying how much of a success it has been will be as impossible as forecasting it beforehand.

Impact that has directly affected me, *already*:

1. Sterling falling off the edge of a cliff the moment the decision to leave was announced. On the plus side, I do have some US stock holdings that are, as a consequence, worth a lot more as a result. On the negative, things undoubtably cost more - anything made from imported materials will have gone up. Holiday spending money, obviously, does not go as far as it used to.

2. The crash of the FTSE. My net worth has taken a hammering as all my ISAs feel the brunt of the uncertainty. Even my pension funds have taken the hit with the income totally wiped out by the unit value decrease. The only positive is that this is paper money and I do not intend crystalising these losses unless the stocks are at risk. Two years of growth totally wiped out, thanks.
So your concern is money worship instead of freedom.
My concern is for freedom as well. Be a shame when I am not free to visit or work anywhere I want in Europe.
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Malabus
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Location: The Death Star.
As the great Nigel Farage said : “Quality not quantity”
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Malabus
Posts: 13336
Joined: 20 Nov 2009, 12:26
Location: The Death Star.
RegencyCheltenhamSpa wrote:
Malabus wrote:
asl wrote:Genuine question, ihearye: irrespective of how you view what May has managed to deliver in terms of options, did you believe that you knew what Brexit would actually look like at the time you voted? If you did, then you're a far wiser person than any of those experts thst the country had had enough of.

That's not a dig - I'm explaining my issue with the whole thing: given that neither campaign were able to provide much detail about why their plan was best and so resorted to dramatising the negatives of the alternative, I opted to remain because the leave campaign failed to convince me that it would be better to leave. Better the Devil you know, and all that... Other people presumably saw the same 'evidence' as me, yet came to a different conclusion and, by a very narrow margin, opted to spin the roulette wheel and see whether things are better outside the EU. I couldn't justify that risk and deeply object to others doing it for me, on my behalf. If it only affected them, then fine - you go for it. But it didn't: it affected me, too. Nevertheless, I am against the idea of a second referendum for the reason you've stated. If the May deal is the ONLY deal, then the option is that or WTO rules (which most industry leaders, who understand the ramifications better than I, think would be a disaster) then we have to go for it.

Fingers crossed, Brexit will be a success. I don't believe it will be - but we need to push forward and try. Quantifying how much of a success it has been will be as impossible as forecasting it beforehand.

Impact that has directly affected me, *already*:

1. Sterling falling off the edge of a cliff the moment the decision to leave was announced. On the plus side, I do have some US stock holdings that are, as a consequence, worth a lot more as a result. On the negative, things undoubtably cost more - anything made from imported materials will have gone up. Holiday spending money, obviously, does not go as far as it used to.

2. The crash of the FTSE. My net worth has taken a hammering as all my ISAs feel the brunt of the uncertainty. Even my pension funds have taken the hit with the income totally wiped out by the unit value decrease. The only positive is that this is paper money and I do not intend crystalising these losses unless the stocks are at risk. Two years of growth totally wiped out, thanks.
So your concern is money worship instead of freedom.
My concern is for freedom as well. Be a shame when I am not free to visit or work anywhere I want in Europe.
Not allowed to visit Europe after Brexit:) what planet are you on.
RegencyCheltenhamSpa
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Apols Mal, I did exaggerate. Hyperbole aside, whilst visiting Europe will be possible, the freedom to do so as we do or to head to a different country to look for a job will be less easy. A key goal of Brexit is to end free movement, which works both ways.
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Malabus
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RegencyCheltenhamSpa wrote:Apols Mal, I did exaggerate. Hyperbole aside, whilst visiting Europe will be possible, the freedom to do so as we do or to head to a different country to look for a job will be less easy. A key goal of Brexit is to end free movement, which works both ways.
Nothing been agreed yet. Could be an option of more red tape : 5€ visas etc or a simple form to fill before a visit to the continent.
We will still Europeans and enjoy visiting Europe.
RegencyCheltenhamSpa
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Malabus wrote:
RegencyCheltenhamSpa wrote:Apols Mal, I did exaggerate. Hyperbole aside, whilst visiting Europe will be possible, the freedom to do so as we do or to head to a different country to look for a job will be less easy. A key goal of Brexit is to end free movement, which works both ways.
Nothing been agreed yet. Could be an option of more red tape : 5€ visas etc or a simple form to fill before a visit to the continent.
We will still Europeans and enjoy visiting Europe.
Thought we were leaving EU to reduce bureaucracy and red tape, not increase it. What about all the couples and families who live in different cities? A form twice every weekend when they get the train to/from Paris or fly to/from Copenhagen etc. 5€ just to spend time with your own kids?
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Malabus
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RegencyCheltenhamSpa wrote:
Malabus wrote:
RegencyCheltenhamSpa wrote:Apols Mal, I did exaggerate. Hyperbole aside, whilst visiting Europe will be possible, the freedom to do so as we do or to head to a different country to look for a job will be less easy. A key goal of Brexit is to end free movement, which works both ways.
Nothing been agreed yet. Could be an option of more red tape : 5€ visas etc or a simple form to fill before a visit to the continent.
We will still Europeans and enjoy visiting Europe.
Thought we were leaving EU to reduce bureaucracy and red tape, not increase it. What about all the couples and families who live in different cities? A form twice every weekend when they get the train to/from Paris or fly to/from Copenhagen etc. 5€ just to spend time with your own kids?
Stop being dramatic and stop listening to #ProjectFear from the sad Remoaners.
RegencyCheltenhamSpa
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Not being dramatic, just asking you how, if freedom of movement is ended, our movement will be as free. I accept that free movement will end, but just curious to know why you think that is a net positive.
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Malabus
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RegencyCheltenhamSpa wrote:Not being dramatic, just asking you how, if freedom of movement is ended, our movement will be as free. I accept that free movement will end, but just curious to know why you think that is a net positive.
OMG....you Remoaners are not on the same planet.

Osbourne said the markets will crash and WWIII will happen.

It from the same source #ProjectFear people that know FECKall
RegencyCheltenhamSpa
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Malabus wrote:
RegencyCheltenhamSpa wrote:Not being dramatic, just asking you how, if freedom of movement is ended, our movement will be as free. I accept that free movement will end, but just curious to know why you think that is a net positive.
OMG....you Remoaners are not on the same planet.

Osbourne said the markets will crash and WWIII will happen.

It from the same source #ProjectFear people that know FECKall
Eh? If we don’t end free movement then it is Brexit In Name Only. It is the demand from Brexit MPs to end free movement which has made a deal so hard to agree. If Malabus is now saying he doesn’t want to end free movement then the world really has gone topsy turvy.
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