League One - clubs in crisis

[Jerry St Clair]

Wigan and Fleetwood we know about.

Speculation is building that Reading are in trouble too. No comms from the club all summer, Chris Wilder was expected to join as manager 3 weeks ago, but still no sign. They've been manageress for 3 months now. A player announced on Instagram he was leaving on Monday, with the club seemingly completely unaware of it. And the owners have said virtually nothing since relegation. They paid their players late in the final month of the season and the Supporter's Trust have requested an urgent meeting with the club to find out what's going on.

Clubs in crisis tend to be closer to relegation places than promotion, so only good news for us.

Any other clubs with problems?

[Ihearye]

Wigan and Fleetwood we know about.

Speculation is building that Reading are in trouble too. No comms from the club all summer, Chris Wilder was expected to join as manager 3 weeks ago, but still no sign. They've been manageress for 3 months now. A player announced on Instagram he was leaving on Monday, with the club seemingly completely unaware of it. And the owners have said virtually nothing since relegation. They paid their players late in the final month of the season and the Supporter's Trust have requested an urgent meeting with the club to find out what's going on.

Clubs in crisis tend to be closer to relegation places than promotion, so only good news for us.

Any other clubs with problems?

Yes FGR, they have a tvvat as an owner. Oh wait sorry, you said League one LOL

[RegencyCheltenhamSpa]

Wigan and Fleetwood we know about.

Speculation is building that Reading are in trouble too. No comms from the club all summer, Chris Wilder was expected to join as manager 3 weeks ago, but still no sign. They've been manageress for 3 months now. A player announced on Instagram he was leaving on Monday, with the club seemingly completely unaware of it. And the owners have said virtually nothing since relegation. They paid their players late in the final month of the season and the Supporter's Trust have requested an urgent meeting with the club to find out what's going on.

Clubs in crisis tend to be closer to relegation places than promotion, so only good news for us.

Any other clubs with problems?

Just need one more and we can kick the four of them out and not have relegation this season.

[paperboy]

Wigan and Fleetwood we know about.

Speculation is building that Reading are in trouble too. No comms from the club all summer, Chris Wilder was expected to join as manager 3 weeks ago, but still no sign. They've been manageress for 3 months now. A player announced on Instagram he was leaving on Monday, with the club seemingly completely unaware of it. And the owners have said virtually nothing since relegation. They paid their players late in the final month of the season and the Supporter's Trust have requested an urgent meeting with the club to find out what's going on.

Clubs in crisis tend to be closer to relegation places than promotion, so only good news for us.

Any other clubs with problems?

Just need one more and we can kick the four of them out and not have relegation this season.

Could League One and Championship clubs band together and vote for only 2 relegation spots from League 1 with the League 2 champions plus playoff winners coming up from League 2.
It would align League 2 with National league clubs.

Bring it in this season I say!

[Si Robin]

Also League 2, Newport have posted losses of £1.2m and have yet to sort a new lease on Rodney Parade with them still owing Dragons Rugby £500k in rent - it's believed the relationship is cordial and that a new lease will be sorted though.

[Uppy]

Wigan and Fleetwood we know about.

Speculation is building that Reading are in trouble too. No comms from the club all summer, Chris Wilder was expected to join as manager 3 weeks ago, but still no sign. They've been manageress for 3 months now. A player announced on Instagram he was leaving on Monday, with the club seemingly completely unaware of it. And the owners have said virtually nothing since relegation. They paid their players late in the final month of the season and the Supporter's Trust have requested an urgent meeting with the club to find out what's going on.

Clubs in crisis tend to be closer to relegation places than promotion, so only good news for us.

Any other clubs with problems?

Just need one more and we can kick the four of them out and not have relegation this season.

I know there’s a supposed right way and a wrong way to succeed but I’d be delighted if as many teams as possible get points deductions, etc

[RegencyCheltenhamSpa]

Wigan and Fleetwood we know about.

Speculation is building that Reading are in trouble too. No comms from the club all summer, Chris Wilder was expected to join as manager 3 weeks ago, but still no sign. They've been manageress for 3 months now. A player announced on Instagram he was leaving on Monday, with the club seemingly completely unaware of it. And the owners have said virtually nothing since relegation. They paid their players late in the final month of the season and the Supporter's Trust have requested an urgent meeting with the club to find out what's going on.

Clubs in crisis tend to be closer to relegation places than promotion, so only good news for us.

Any other clubs with problems?

Just need one more and we can kick the four of them out and not have relegation this season.

I know there’s a supposed right way and a wrong way to succeed but I’d be delighted if as many teams as possible get points deductions, etc

In a sense, other teams being penalised for cheating/breaking rules is us succeeding by us doing things the right way.

How often have we missed out to teams who cheat their way to promotion whilst we do things right?

[Shade]

Exactly, us surviving in this division whilst others are being run poorly and getting deductions is our success. We're a stable club punching above our weight whilst other, mostly bigger, clubs overspend and fail miserably.

I see some of those entitled fans of other "big" clubs call it a tinpot division because of the smaller clubs in it. I see it as their club being c!#p enough to have dropped to the third tier. They're the ones crying and having a strop about being in L1, not us.

[QED]

Reading have had a wage bill far in excess of turnover in the Championship for a long time - it was 234% of turnover in 20/21 and was down to 150% in the most recent accounts - gambling on going up, so leaving the Championship the other way must put them even further in the hole. They spent £25m on wages last year… unbelievable folly.

[HamTown]

Not saying it's quite to the reckless scale as the clubs mentioned here but didn't we gamble beyond our means to get back out of the national league with GJ?

Recall talk of going part time had we missed out

[longmover]

the farce continues

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/65909639

[longmover]

Reading seem to be in a total mess, no manager, owners done a runner (potentially), eight senior players, no contracts approach to players, head scout has left for stoke and £200m of debt.

more than likely will be administration soon.

[Shade]

Not saying it's quite to the reckless scale as the clubs mentioned here but didn't we gamble beyond our means to get back out of the national league with GJ?

Recall talk of going part time had we missed out

As far as I recall, it wasn't a gamble that would have killed the club, but it was a gamble in that the board allowed GJ to use all of the parachute payment in one go in order to attempt operation bounceback. So yeah, if it hadn't have come off, we'd have been surviving on NL gates and sponsorship and might have had to go part time if it all went really wrong.

However, if the gamble hadn't have been taken, it might have just been delaying the inevitable anyway. Risk vs Reward. Give it a go now and possibly end up part time, or use a bit each season, get a bunch of mid-table finishes and then possibly have to go part-time in 3 or 4 years, ending up like Yeovil, etc. The good thing about being a stable club is that when we got relegated, we could use the funds on the squad and not trying to dig our way out of a money pit.

[Jerry St Clair]

Yeah, I’d say calculated risk rather than gamble.

I maintain that if we hadn’t bounced back at the first attempt, we’d still be there and probably hovering around mid-table. And GJ, should he ever return to WR, should get a hero’s welcome.

[Jerry St Clair]

The crisis at Wigan seems to have been averted for the time being. No change to the points deduction though.

[Shade]

I maintain that if we hadn’t bounced back at the first attempt, we’d still be there and probably hovering around mid-table. And GJ, should he ever return to WR, should get a hero’s welcome.

I agree, but obviously hard to know for sure. Would MD have come to us if we were in the NL when he was looking for his first managerial job? Would he have been able to get us up? Who knows.

GJ is of course a CTFC legend for what he did. The good outweighs the bad and was far more significant. Any manager who has ever got CTFC promoted is a hero and should be treated as such.

[RegencyCheltenhamSpa]

I maintain that if we hadn’t bounced back at the first attempt, we’d still be there and probably hovering around mid-table. And GJ, should he ever return to WR, should get a hero’s welcome.

I agree, but obviously hard to know for sure. Would MD have come to us if we were in the NL when he was looking for his first managerial job? Would he have been able to get us up? Who knows.

GJ is of course a CTFC legend for what he did. The good outweighs the bad and was far more significant. Any manager who has ever got CTFC promoted is a hero and should be treated as such.

Giants standing on the shoulders of giants. Plenty of heroes in our history and as you say, they should be remembered as such no matter which heroes follow.

[Jerry St Clair]

Reading charged with failing to pay players wages on time. Owner also charged with causing the club to be in Regulations breach. Possible points deduction incoming. Again.

https://www.efl.com/news/2023/june/efl- ... eading-fc/

[RegencyCheltenhamSpa]

Thoughtful thread from Martin Calladine (author of football books) in light of the Reading situ:

“It's good that Reading fans are uniting to drive out an unsuitable owner. But once that's done, and the club stabilised, there needs also to be some self-reflection. How many people angry at Dai previously called for John Madejski to sell, saying he lacked cash and/or ambition?

How many welcomed successive takeovers by people with unclear sources of wealth and no prior connection to the club and town because they believed it would enable them to buy and maintain a place in the Premier League?

How many made excuses when the original wage delay happened or the club sold its own stadium because money was still being spent on players? When wages hit 200%+ of income, how many were more worried about FFP than the club's long-term existence?

Almost every club-wrecking, unsuitable owner has, at some point, been popular with that club's fans because they were splashing the cash and looking determined to buy success for the club.

Yes, clubs need more protection from an Independent Regulator and a beefed up Owners and Directors Test. But fans also need to take some responsibility for the fact that they almost always cheered on ruinous spending when it was happening.

If we want a better, more sustainable future for football and to safeguard the future of our beloved clubs, then we must also be more sceptical of new owners and, above all, stop demanding they buy us unearned success.“

[longmover]

Been saying this for many years now, I couldn’t give a toss when supporters of these clubs start piping up about how unfair it all is as those ‘fans’ where cheering from the rafters and giving it the ‘big un’ when all that dodgy money was winning them things.

If your bent club disappears then I really don’t care.

[Jerry St Clair]

Been saying this for many years now, I couldn’t give a toss when supporters of these clubs start piping up about how unfair it all is as those ‘fans’ where cheering from the rafters and giving it the ‘big un’ when all that dodgy money was winning them things.

If your bent club disappears then I really don’t care.

This is hugely unfair.

Not all fans cheer from the rafters. Some do, but it's more complicated than that. Take Newcastle. Lots of fans have deep reservations about the owners. But what can they do? Boycott the club? Keep going along but make their feelings known? Keep going but bite their lip? There's not much in practical terms that fans can do. And you're emotionally attached. It's not like boycotting Tesco and shopping at Asda instead.

[RegencyCheltenhamSpa]

Been saying this for many years now, I couldn’t give a toss when supporters of these clubs start piping up about how unfair it all is as those ‘fans’ where cheering from the rafters and giving it the ‘big un’ when all that dodgy money was winning them things.

If your bent club disappears then I really don’t care.

This is hugely unfair.

Not all fans cheer from the rafters. Some do, but it's more complicated than that. Take Newcastle. Lots of fans have deep reservations about the owners. But what can they do? Boycott the club? Keep going along but make their feelings known? Keep going but bite their lip? There's not much in practical terms that fans can do. And you're emotionally attached. It's not like boycotting Tesco and shopping at Asda instead.

I suppose the thing to do is make clear before a takeover, or whilst it is ongoing, that the majority of fans will boycott buying season tickets.

If a dodgy owner tried to take us over in a May or June and not one ST was sold as a result of then they would back down. Perhaps different for clubs who own their ground where owning the ground and land is an asset regardless of whether the club exists.

For a club like Man U, it doesn’t matter if a million people boycott as 75,000 still turn up and 100 million but shorts. But for smaller clubs, a boycott by the vast majority of fans would bankrupt the club and hopefully prevent an owner taking over as no one would take over a club guaranteed to have barely any income.

[asl]

Is it always completely obvious in advance that a new owner is a wrong 'un...? Do they wear a special t-shirt that says it on the front?

[Fuller]

Wouldn’t surprise me that many club supporters haven’t got a clue who their owners are and will turn up and support the team whatever.

[RegencyCheltenhamSpa]

Is it always completely obvious in advance that a new owner is a wrong 'un...? Do they wear a special t-shirt that says it on the front?

Usually it’s bloody obvious. Though I guess people have been buying snake oil for centuries so obviously some people are taken in.

[Si Robin]

A very good read here on fans and the lauding of rich owners before it all turns sour:

https://theuglygame.wordpress.com/2023/ ... -own-ruin/

[longmover]

Been saying this for many years now, I couldn’t give a toss when supporters of these clubs start piping up about how unfair it all is as those ‘fans’ where cheering from the rafters and giving it the ‘big un’ when all that dodgy money was winning them things.

If your bent club disappears then I really don’t care.

This is hugely unfair.

Not all fans cheer from the rafters. Some do, but it's more complicated than that. Take Newcastle. Lots of fans have deep reservations about the owners. But what can they do? Boycott the club? Keep going along but make their feelings known? Keep going but bite their lip? There's not much in practical terms that fans can do. And you're emotionally attached. It's not like boycotting Tesco and shopping at Asda instead.

yes it really looks like all those geordies at St James's are having serious reservations about their owner, when their club turns into a circus (which it will in a couple of years) we'll have to endure all their whinging on how awful it all is, jog on.

of course you can boycott the club, the majority of these supporters are adults(?), if an owner came here and started to splash cash well over our means I would boycott the club straight away.

[Jerry St Clair]

Reading served with a winding up petition by HMRC today for non-payment of PAYE taxes.

Apparently standard procedure and, assuming Reading have settled the debt, not as serious as it sounds.

But when clubs start heading down this road it rarely ends well.

[1985CTFC]

Oh dear oh dear latest news for Reading, Shame!

Reading have been placed under an immediate transfer embargo for failing to pay HMRC on time again, the Reading Chronicle understands.

Good time to play them in our 3rd game. Think they have lost all 4 preseason matches and not won I think in about 13 games last season. Think I read. I stand corrected if wrong.
Add 3 points to your forecast!! Cocky eh?

[Jerry St Clair]

Good time to play them in our 3rd game. Think they have lost all 4 preseason matches and not won I think in about 13 games last season. Think I read. I stand corrected if wrong.
Add 3 points to your forecast!! Cocky eh?

Last win was on 25 February at home to Blackpool.

You're not a proper football fan if you're immediate reaction to such a stat isn't "well, they're bound to beat us then".

[longmover]

Oh dear oh dear latest news for Reading, Shame!

Reading have been placed under an immediate transfer embargo for failing to pay HMRC on time again, the Reading Chronicle understands.

Good time to play them in our 3rd game. Think they have lost all 4 preseason matches and not won I think in about 13 games last season. Think I read. I stand corrected if wrong.
Add 3 points to your forecast!! Cocky eh?

evidently the owner of reading struggles to get money out of China that's why these payments are being missed (not made), its a total farse.

[Broadway Brian]

Good time to play them in our 3rd game. Think they have lost all 4 preseason matches and not won I think in about 13 games last season. Think I read. I stand corrected if wrong.
Add 3 points to your forecast!! Cocky eh?

Last win was on 25 February at home to Blackpool.

You're not a proper football fan if you're immediate reaction to such a stat isn't "well, they're bound to beat us then".

100%. Still reeling from us bending over for Oxford at the end of last season and helping them avoid the drop.

[Shade]

Cheltenham are, and always will be, the breaker of bad runs.

[Robin]

Reading back under a transfer embargo after making signings and speculation they may now face a points deduction. We definitely go there at a good time to play them.

[RegencyCheltenhamSpa]

Good time to play them in our 3rd game. Think they have lost all 4 preseason matches and not won I think in about 13 games last season. Think I read. I stand corrected if wrong.
Add 3 points to your forecast!! Cocky eh?

Last win was on 25 February at home to Blackpool.

You're not a proper football fan if you're immediate reaction to such a stat isn't "well, they're bound to beat us then".

100%. Still reeling from us bending over for Oxford at the end of last season and helping them avoid the drop.

Oxford was a unique circumstance. The mental and physical energy used to guarantee safety meant we were spent. Burnt out. Like getting a cold or flu on your first day off after a stressful intense month of work.

Whereas Oxford would have been building up to that match for weeks.