St Joseph’s FC

[Fuller]

https://www.stjosephsfcgib.co.uk/news/s ... am-town-fc

I’ll be following their progress this season with interest and good luck to them, along with MG’s other club Antequera FC.

[Robin]

Any possibility to send some of our fringe players there on loan do you think?

[Ihearye]

Any possibility to send some of our fringe players there on loan do you think?

You will need to clear that with Spanish government and Spanish border patrol

[Artemis]

Any possibility to send some of our fringe players there on loan do you think?

You will need to clear that with Spanish government and Spanish border patrol

Why exactly would that be needed?

[Shade]

Any possibility to send some of our fringe players there on loan do you think?

You will need to clear that with Spanish government and Spanish border patrol

Why exactly would that be needed?

Well, they control the border now (I'm not sure if it has already started), so presumably they can deny entry.

[Artemis]

You will need to clear that with Spanish government and Spanish border patrol

Why exactly would that be needed?

Well, they control the border now (I'm not sure if it has already started), so presumably they can deny entry.

The Spanish government doesn't control entry into Gibraltar. That's a competency of the Gibraltar authorities and remains so under the latest agreement with Spain.

[joes dad]

"Following a recent agreement, SPAIN WILL HAVE THE FINAL SAY on whether a British traveler can enter Gibraltar, even though Gibraltar remains under British sovereignty, according to The Independent. This is part of a Brexit deal that aims to keep the border between Gibraltar and Spain open, but also gives Spain a role in immigration and asylum matters on the Rock, reports the London Evening Standard. "
You can thank the genius Lammy for this.

[asl]

You can thank the genius Lammy for this.

And the planks who voted for Brexit...

[tunnelvision]

You can thank the genius Lammy for this.

And the planks who voted for Brexit...

Nothing to do with Brexit.

Everything to do with the planks that voted Labour.

Also, I believe that Lammy’s deal puts Gibraltar into the Schengen zone. If so, access will be limited to 90 days in every 180 (including time spent in other EU countries).

[Malabus]

You can thank the genius Lammy for this.

And the planks who voted for Brexit...

The MAJORITY are certainly not planks.

Remoaners are still crying....inject it into my veins.

Its Liebour's DAVID LAMMY that you should be pointing your finger at...

[Ihearye]

You can thank the genius Lammy for this.

And the planks who voted for Brexit...

Nothing to do with Brexit.

Everything to do with the planks that voted Labour.

Also, I believe that Lammy’s deal puts Gibraltar into the Schengen zone. If so, access will be limited to 90 days in every 180 (including time spent in other EU countries).

The ineptitude is astounding.
If you have a holiday property there, you are now restricted.
If you have relatives there, who you visit regularly you are now restricted.

[Artemis]

"Following a recent agreement, SPAIN WILL HAVE THE FINAL SAY on whether a British traveler can enter Gibraltar, even though Gibraltar remains under British sovereignty, according to The Independent. This is part of a Brexit deal that aims to keep the border between Gibraltar and Spain open, but also gives Spain a role in immigration and asylum matters on the Rock, reports the London Evening Standard. "
You can thank the genius Lammy for this.

Here's the actual facts, rather than one newspapers interpretation:

https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/uk ... en-agreed/

Key Points:
- a customs union between Gibraltar and the EU to ease the transfer of goods between the two territories.
- Schengen area checks taking place inside Gibraltar, rather than at the border, easing movt of people across the border with Spain.
- Residents of Gibraltar aren't affected by Schengen restrictions.
- The govt of Gibraltar retains controls of immigration, policing and justice in Gibraltar, so has control over who is deemed a resident or not.

The residents of Gibraltar have been desperate for an agreement that means that they and goods can move far more easily across the border with the EU (i.e. Spain). This agreement seems to be them exercising self-determination and sovereignty rather than having restrictions on their every day lives foisted on them by what UK residents want.

[Ihearye]

"Following a recent agreement, SPAIN WILL HAVE THE FINAL SAY on whether a British traveler can enter Gibraltar, even though Gibraltar remains under British sovereignty, according to The Independent. This is part of a Brexit deal that aims to keep the border between Gibraltar and Spain open, but also gives Spain a role in immigration and asylum matters on the Rock, reports the London Evening Standard. "
You can thank the genius Lammy for this.

Here's the actual facts, rather than one newspapers interpretation:

https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/uk ... en-agreed/

Key Points:
- a customs union between Gibraltar and the EU to ease the transfer of goods between the two territories.
- Schengen area checks taking place inside Gibraltar, rather than at the border, easing movt of people across the border with Spain.
- Residents of Gibraltar aren't affected by Schengen restrictions.
- The govt of Gibraltar retains controls of immigration, policing and justice in Gibraltar, so has control over who is deemed a resident or not.

The residents of Gibraltar have been desperate for an agreement that means that they and goods can move far more easily across the border with the EU (i.e. Spain). This agreement seems to be them exercising self-determination and sovereignty rather than having restrictions on their every day lives foisted on them by what UK residents want.

You obviously fail to understand a lot. Of course they are not affected by the Schengen restrictions, because they are now in the Schengen group. Who is does affect, is British people wanting to go there on a regular basis. Now do you understand ?

[Artemis]

You can thank the genius Lammy for this.

And the planks who voted for Brexit...

Nothing to do with Brexit.

Everything to do with the planks that voted Labour.

Also, I believe that Lammy’s deal puts Gibraltar into the Schengen zone. If so, access will be limited to 90 days in every 180 (including time spent in other EU countries).

You can believe what you want, but the govt's deal does not legally put Gibraltar into the Schengen treaties. Yes, access to Gibraltar for non-Schengen residents is limited to 90 days in every 180. But that is a trade off that the Gibraltar govt have decided to make to simplify their residents daily lives. It's their choice. Why should the daily lives of the Gibraltese be impacted so that the UK residents that do visit shouldn't be restricted? If you want to visit more frequently, then apply for residency in Gibraltar.
The outcome is very much a consequence of the UK's decision to withdraw from the EU - if that hadn't happened, then this wouldn't have happened either. Its little different to the restrictions that the UK imposed on itself on travel to Spain, France etc.

[paperboy]

Advantage to Artemis.

Ihearye serving to save the set.

[Artemis]

"Following a recent agreement, SPAIN WILL HAVE THE FINAL SAY on whether a British traveler can enter Gibraltar, even though Gibraltar remains under British sovereignty, according to The Independent. This is part of a Brexit deal that aims to keep the border between Gibraltar and Spain open, but also gives Spain a role in immigration and asylum matters on the Rock, reports the London Evening Standard. "
You can thank the genius Lammy for this.

Here's the actual facts, rather than one newspapers interpretation:

https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/uk ... en-agreed/

Key Points:
- a customs union between Gibraltar and the EU to ease the transfer of goods between the two territories.
- Schengen area checks taking place inside Gibraltar, rather than at the border, easing movt of people across the border with Spain.
- Residents of Gibraltar aren't affected by Schengen restrictions.
- The govt of Gibraltar retains controls of immigration, policing and justice in Gibraltar, so has control over who is deemed a resident or not.

The residents of Gibraltar have been desperate for an agreement that means that they and goods can move far more easily across the border with the EU (i.e. Spain). This agreement seems to be them exercising self-determination and sovereignty rather than having restrictions on their every day lives foisted on them by what UK residents want.

You obviously fail to understand a lot. Of course they are not affected by the Schengen restrictions, because they are now in the Schengen group. Who is does affect, is British people wanting to go there on a regular basis. Now do you understand ?

Yes, I fully understand thank you....and yes, it is UK residents who are now impacted. But I'd say that's a minor inconvenience than the impact the post-Brexit arrangements had on the economy of Gibraltar and the lives of its residents. It was always going to be a consequence of the UK's democratic decision to leave the UK once the Gibraltese made a decision to get back to seamless trading and movement across the border with Spain for their benefit - just cos it wasn't on the side of bus, doesn't make it otherwise.
Or perhaps the impact on Gibraltar should have continued just so that UK residents wouldn't be affected? Do enlighten us as to what the alternative resolution to this is?

[Artemis]

Anyway, back on track. In the event that CTFC wanted to loan a player to St Joseph's that player would make an application to work in Gibraltar, it would more than likely be approved by the Gibraltar authorities, and bingo, they could play for St Joes. Although Gibraltar is an overseas territory of the UK, its always had its own immigration framework which has always applied to UK residents.
Same process would apply to Antequera. Although given that they play in the equivalent of the L1 in Spain it seems less unlikely that we would loan a player to them (cue debate about the relative strength of Spanish football vs English)

[Ihearye]

Here's the actual facts, rather than one newspapers interpretation:

https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/uk ... en-agreed/

Key Points:
- a customs union between Gibraltar and the EU to ease the transfer of goods between the two territories.
- Schengen area checks taking place inside Gibraltar, rather than at the border, easing movt of people across the border with Spain.
- Residents of Gibraltar aren't affected by Schengen restrictions.
- The govt of Gibraltar retains controls of immigration, policing and justice in Gibraltar, so has control over who is deemed a resident or not.

The residents of Gibraltar have been desperate for an agreement that means that they and goods can move far more easily across the border with the EU (i.e. Spain). This agreement seems to be them exercising self-determination and sovereignty rather than having restrictions on their every day lives foisted on them by what UK residents want.

You obviously fail to understand a lot. Of course they are not affected by the Schengen restrictions, because they are now in the Schengen group. Who is does affect, is British people wanting to go there on a regular basis. Now do you understand ?

Yes, I fully understand thank you....and yes, it is UK residents who are now impacted. But I'd say that's a minor inconvenience than the impact the post-Brexit arrangements had on the economy of Gibraltar and the lives of its residents. It was always going to be a consequence of the UK's democratic decision to leave the UK once the Gibraltese made a decision to get back to seamless trading and movement across the border with Spain for their benefit - just cos it wasn't on the side of bus, doesn't make it otherwise.
Or perhaps the impact on Gibraltar should have continued just so that UK residents wouldn't be affected? Do enlighten us as to what the alternative resolution to this is?

Obviously you have the stats to back up your 'minor inconvenience' and the impact on the lives of the people that live there? That would be a people who at liberty to decide via a referendum which country they want to align to.
Fabian Picardo looked so happy as he was made to stand beside the idiot Lammy, as this great deal was explained.
My alternative? Difference is I am not so presumptuous as to tell other people what is best for them. They can make their own minds up. If free trade was their biggest concern, the answer all to obvious.

[Artemis]

You obviously fail to understand a lot. Of course they are not affected by the Schengen restrictions, because they are now in the Schengen group. Who is does affect, is British people wanting to go there on a regular basis. Now do you understand ?

Yes, I fully understand thank you....and yes, it is UK residents who are now impacted. But I'd say that's a minor inconvenience than the impact the post-Brexit arrangements had on the economy of Gibraltar and the lives of its residents. It was always going to be a consequence of the UK's democratic decision to leave the UK once the Gibraltese made a decision to get back to seamless trading and movement across the border with Spain for their benefit - just cos it wasn't on the side of bus, doesn't make it otherwise.
Or perhaps the impact on Gibraltar should have continued just so that UK residents wouldn't be affected? Do enlighten us as to what the alternative resolution to this is?

Obviously you have the stats to back up your 'minor inconvenience' and the impact on the lives of the people that live there? That would be a people who at liberty to decide via a referendum which country they want to align to.
Fabian Picardo looked so happy as he was made to stand beside the idiot Lammy, as this great deal was explained.
My alternative? Difference is I am not so presumptuous as to tell other people what is best for them. They can make their own minds up. If free trade was their biggest concern, the answer all to obvious.

Approximately 15,000 people cross the Spanish / Gibraltar at La Linea daily (*). For each and every crossing, there are two document checks. And that's just for people. That's an inconvenience. Are 15,000 UK residents per day really going to be actually inconvenienced by this?

Far from me or the UK govt telling the Gibraltese what to do, its an arrangement that the Gibraltar govt and people want. Thats self-determination at play. Its their decision to accept it.
You may not like David Lammy or his politics, but I think its a bit unfair to call anyone with an masters degree in law from Harvard "an idiot".

Finally, I was intrigued what you thought the alternative was - I don't think that's presuming that it has to be accepted by Gibraltar. They'll chose what they believe to be in their best interests, just like the UK did in 2016.

* https://www.gov.uk/government/news/agre ... %20checked.

[Artemis]

You can thank the genius Lammy for this.

And the planks who voted for Brexit...

The MAJORITY are certainly not planks.

Remoaners are still crying....inject it into my veins.

Its Liebour's DAVID LAMMY that you should be pointing your finger at...

I'm not moaning. Its just a bit weird that the majority of complaints about this new arrangement seem to come from those who supported the UK's democratic decision to leave the EU. I think all the rest of us are asking is for the natural consequences of that decision to be owned by those that made it.

[Ihearye]

Yes, I fully understand thank you....and yes, it is UK residents who are now impacted. But I'd say that's a minor inconvenience than the impact the post-Brexit arrangements had on the economy of Gibraltar and the lives of its residents. It was always going to be a consequence of the UK's democratic decision to leave the UK once the Gibraltese made a decision to get back to seamless trading and movement across the border with Spain for their benefit - just cos it wasn't on the side of bus, doesn't make it otherwise.
Or perhaps the impact on Gibraltar should have continued just so that UK residents wouldn't be affected? Do enlighten us as to what the alternative resolution to this is?

Obviously you have the stats to back up your 'minor inconvenience' and the impact on the lives of the people that live there? That would be a people who at liberty to decide via a referendum which country they want to align to.
Fabian Picardo looked so happy as he was made to stand beside the idiot Lammy, as this great deal was explained.
My alternative? Difference is I am not so presumptuous as to tell other people what is best for them. They can make their own minds up. If free trade was their biggest concern, the answer all to obvious.

Approximately 15,000 people cross the Spanish / Gibraltar at La Linea daily (*). For each and every crossing, there are two document checks. And that's just for people. That's an inconvenience. Are 15,000 UK residents per day really going to be actually inconvenienced by this?

Far from me or the UK govt telling the Gibraltese what to do, its an arrangement that the Gibraltar govt and people want. Thats self-determination at play. Its their decision to accept it.
You may not like David Lammy or his politics, but I think its a bit unfair to call anyone with an masters degree in law from Harvard "an idiot".

Finally, I was intrigued what you thought the alternative was - I don't think that's presuming that it has to be accepted by Gibraltar. They'll chose what they believe to be in their best interests, just like the UK did in 2016.

* https://www.gov.uk/government/news/agre ... %20checked.

Well we all know Diane Abbott went to Cambridge and we also know what a mastermind she has proven herself to be.

You really don't seem to grasp the basic argument do you? There was a vote, the majority voted to leave. Being part of that democracy Gibraltar had to go along with the vote and abide by any consequences of that decision. However, if they objected to it so much in the intervening years, they have also had in their power to rejoin the EU via voting to break away from UK. The fact that they have not chosen that route, would tend to have one believe that they valued their independence from Spain and the EU slightly more than any pain they were suffering.

As for the number border crossing every day, of those 15,000, 10,000 are Spanish. So who was having the most pain and who has gained the most? Again, simple maths should answer that one. The average yearly trade between the two countries is circa $1,300 million in Spain's favour. So again, who has most impacted by Brexit between the two countries and who has most to gain by Lammy's deal?

[Wellwisher]

Gibraltar's Chief Minister Fabian Picardo said the deal would "protect future generations of British Gibraltarians and does not in any way affect our British sovereignty".
"Now is the time to look beyond the arguments of the past and towards a time of renewed co-operation and understanding. Now the deal is done, it's time to finalise the treaty."
https://www.itv.com/news/2025-06-11/uk- ... r-and-spai

My view is that if it's good enough for the Chief Minister, it should be good enough for the rest of us. Good luck to them.

[Artemis]

Obviously you have the stats to back up your 'minor inconvenience' and the impact on the lives of the people that live there? That would be a people who at liberty to decide via a referendum which country they want to align to.
Fabian Picardo looked so happy as he was made to stand beside the idiot Lammy, as this great deal was explained.
My alternative? Difference is I am not so presumptuous as to tell other people what is best for them. They can make their own minds up. If free trade was their biggest concern, the answer all to obvious.

Approximately 15,000 people cross the Spanish / Gibraltar at La Linea daily (*). For each and every crossing, there are two document checks. And that's just for people. That's an inconvenience. Are 15,000 UK residents per day really going to be actually inconvenienced by this?

Far from me or the UK govt telling the Gibraltese what to do, its an arrangement that the Gibraltar govt and people want. Thats self-determination at play. Its their decision to accept it.
You may not like David Lammy or his politics, but I think its a bit unfair to call anyone with an masters degree in law from Harvard "an idiot".

Finally, I was intrigued what you thought the alternative was - I don't think that's presuming that it has to be accepted by Gibraltar. They'll chose what they believe to be in their best interests, just like the UK did in 2016.

* https://www.gov.uk/government/news/agre ... %20checked.

Well we all know Diane Abbott went to Cambridge and we also know what a mastermind she has proven herself to be.

You really don't seem to grasp the basic argument do you? There was a vote, the majority voted to leave. Being part of that democracy Gibraltar had to go along with the vote and abide by any consequences of that decision. However, if they objected to it so much in the intervening years, they have also had in their power to rejoin the EU via voting to break away from UK. The fact that they have not chosen that route, would tend to have one believe that they valued their independence from Spain and the EU slightly more than any pain they were suffering.

As for the number border crossing every day, of those 15,000, 10,000 are Spanish. So who was having the most pain and who has gained the most? Again, simple maths should answer that one. The average yearly trade between the two countries is circa $1,300 million in Spain's favour. So again, who has most impacted by Brexit between the two countries and who has most to gain by Lammy's deal?

Of course Gib imports more from Spain than it exports and of course more people go to work there from Spain than the other way round - Gib's a densely-populated rock with a service oriented economy and has little spare land. Spain produces lots and has plenty of people wanting relatively well-paid work.
The most important point though is that Gibraltar has the deal it needed and wanted, its sovereignty isn't changed and there is little to no material impact on the UK.

But in an effort to get this thread back on track.......
There is absolutely nothing in the new agreement that would prevent the Gib authorities issuing the necessary immigration paperwork for a CTFC player to move on loan to St Josephs.

The standard of Gib football isn't quite as bad as one might think. Ironically, some players come from and live in southern Spain, with previous experience in Spain's RFEF divisions (L2 / National League equivalent).

St Joe's finished second last season so will be in the qual rounds for the Conference league - again. Last season they lost 3-2 to Shelbourne in the first qual round.
Assuming Mike Garlick's take-over goes through, I'll be following them. Anyone but Lincoln Red Imps.....
Maybe away friendlies in both Gib and Antequera at some point?

[Artemis]

Update:
St Joe's kick off their Conference campaign against Cliftonville next Tuesday, 8th July, at the Europa Point stadium.

[Fuller]

St Joseph’s upcoming fixtures in Europe-

https://www.stjosephsfcgib.co.uk/news/u ... iftonville

[Fuller]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/live/c8j1m8kd9p3t